Re: [NTLK] The "iMoleskine" ?

On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 1:41 AM, Lord Groundhog <LordGroundhog@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Now as to your assertion of a Newton 2.0. I'm not so sure. The Newton
>> OS (2.0 and 2.1) stretched the OS beyond its capabilities. To
>> resurrect that aged and creaky OS would be a disaster and a mistake....
>
> Sorry; we're talking at crossed purposes here. I should have been more
> precise. When I wrote "Newton 2.0" I was referring to a second run at the
> Newton; i.e., as shorthand for "Newton Mark II", not the operating system
> ("NOS"), which as you say was/is 2.0 and 2.1 and wouldn't be fit to revive
> "as is". But a new version of the Newt -- and I have a very clear idea of
> how I'd like to see this designed -- would still be a fantastic idea if they
> got it right.

Aha. I hoped you meant such a thing, but having read so many comments
on the web (wherever the Newton gets mentioned in blogs/web pages,
people comment that Apple should bring the old Newton back...) I get a
little gun-shy. :-)
>> Also, to emulate it, other than maybe its most basic form (notepad,
>> intertwingledness) would also be a mistake, IMO. People today want
>> color, flash, web browsing, etc. They have all that in the iPhone. The
>> iPhone is a _huge_ hit. I fear that handwriting recognition is dead. I
>> know that, on my Treo with its keyboard, I _hate_ pulling out the
>> stylus. I certainly can type faster on it than I can do grafitti, and
>> I've only used the keyboard for a few weeks. Yes, handwriting is nice,
>> but people aren't going to wait for it to learn them, and I certainly
>> suspect that people don't want a stylus. Nothing says "geek" or worse,
>> "nerd" louder than the stylus today. A stylus-based OS would be too
>> anachronistic, and too much of a niche product.
>>
> You're right; people want flashier things today: colour, Flash, etc. And I
> agree that the iPhone and to some extent the iPod Touch meets those needs
> admirably. No question. But I don't think these new-fangled things and the
> things we know and love about our Newtons have to be mutually exclusive.

I would like to think not, but since nobody has come close to the
Newton, I can't help but wonder if we are really on the fringe!

> And when we move on to what I call the real productivity uses, and also to
> the whole topic of HWR, well, I guess we might have to agree to disagree
> about some things. When I've tried other stylus-based gizmos, the
> frustration I feel from being made to learn to write some artificial
> characters, and then from discovering how slow that makes the process, makes
> me chuck the thing into the back of a drawer or give it away to anyone
> who'll have it. The Newton is different. I suppose if the Newton didn't
> read my handwriting so well, I wouldn't feel so "connected" to it. But my
> Newton learned my handwriting very quickly as it happened, and it's not only
> a matter of how speedily I can write, but where I can write, and how I even
> can write standing up (when I can't open out a keyboard). It's the most
> natural way for me to enter data and to make notes and all the rest. For
> example, I was in a philosophy lecture the other day. Taking notes
> (including a few drawings copying the lecturer's illustrations, and to
> outline the formal logic) was a snap. A keyboard would've let me down over
> the graphics. And the result is this sense I have of being "attached" to my
> Newton. It's as if my Newt understands me. Does it make sense? Not
> altogether. It just is.

No disagreements with you there! That's why I prefer my Newton for
note-taking. In fact, i was just using it on a seminar. To me, the
best paper notebook that ever existed was the Newton. ;-) My problem
now, however, is that it is no longer convenient for me to carry
multiple (and one very large) electronic devices around all day, every
day. So the Newton gets relegated to those times when I know I will
need it. That's why I wish Apple could have made one with the screen
size of a 120/130, and as thick as my Tungsten. That would have been
sweet! ;-)

> And for whatever reason, you and I seem to have different experiences of
> people's responses. As soon as it becomes evident that I'm not tapping a
> screen keyboard, or worse, writing one artificial character at a time, but
> I'm really writing, I can count on a few people wanting to talk about my
> Newton. Recently, I've finally mustered up the nerve to switch on "Guest
> User" in the preferences when I met a really keen person, to let them try it
> for themselves. I've done it a few times since. Very few people have
> responded unappreciatively to the experience, and a more common reaction is
> "are they expensive or hard to find now?" Words like "geek" and "nerd"
> aren't common responses in my experience, although I admit I wouldn't be
> deterred by them even if they were. And, "anachronistic"? We'll definitely
> have to agree to disagree about that. IMO the real anachronism was when the
> Newton first appeared, wa-a-a-ay ahead of its time. Now is just about the
> right time for it. ;)

I used to love setting "guest mode" but people were always
disappointed with how it recognized their handwriting. They'd watch my
checken scratch get recognized perfectly, and wonder why they couldn't
do it. ;-) So, on the one hand, it was always "Wow" but also
disappointment. That's why I say that whatever it is, it needs to work
out of the bo for everybody. I suspect that is the single reason that
keyboards and grafitti sell. Long-term, the satisfaction is much less
than true HWR, but out of the box experience trumps. (Sadly)

> As for "niche product", I accept that: I happen to share a particular niche
> with other people who crave a certain kind of functionality and don't care
> how we get it. And I think there are even more people who would join me in
> this niche if the product were there for them.
>
>> That said, nothing will entirely replace my Newton. I still use it
>> (but only at my desk) almost daily--but I'll be honest. I doubt I
>> could give a rational reason. I like it--it's familiar, and I don't
>> wish to stop using it. But I couldn't convince anybody to buy one now.
>> Sorry, but iPhone _is_ Newton 2.0--whatever that means....
>>
> I guess you and I will continue to rate the iPhone differently. But I can't
> help noticing that, after we can debate all the points we might not agree
> about the Newton, we come back together when you and I both say, "nothing
> will entirely replace my Newton. ... I doubt I could give a rational
> reason." I don't know why, but as long as my Newton "knows" me and does
> what I need better than anything else out there, I don't see me replacing it
> with anything else.

With you there, dude. :-) Unfortunately, what with the iPhone, I doubt
we will ever see a Newton-like device any more. Besides the fact that
text/faxing/calendars, etc. are so 20th century to too many people.
Most people want mobile web, music and videos, or so it seems. Look at
the Nokiatablet, for instance, no PIM software at all! Go figure. ;-)

Speaking of the nokia. Anybody got Einstein compiled on OS 2008? How's
it work? With the prices on the N800 where they are, I'm seriously
considering one.

-- 
 -Jon Glass
Krakow, Poland
<jonglass@usa.net>
"I don't believe in philosophies. I believe in fundamentals." --Jack Nicklaus
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