[NTLK] Newton USB Dongle
Jeff Sheldon
jeffsheldon at gmail.com
Mon Feb 6 11:43:18 EST 2017
Sent that too soon thanks to Gmail and unexpected keybindings.
https://www.jae.com/z-en/product_en.cfm?l_code=EN&series_code=IL-WX&product_number=IL-WX-32PB-VF-BE
Good PDF documentation included.
-Jeff
On Mon, Feb 6, 2017 at 10:42 AM, Jeff Sheldon <jeffsheldon at gmail.com> wrote:
> Matthias,
>
> You're not kidding about that minimum and it looks like a 3 month wait
> time from JAE. Not a small price attached either. :-(
>
> For reference, here's JAE's page on the internal interconnect:
>
>
> http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/jae-electronics/IL-WX-32PB-VF-BE/IL-WX-32PB-VF-BE-ND/5397414
>
>
>
> -Jeff
>
> On Mon, Feb 6, 2017 at 6:19 AM, Matthias Melcher <mm at matthiasm.com> wrote:
>>
>> I have a few internal modem connectors still here. If the demand is big enough, we can have more made by JAE. The minimum order is 300. This is btw how I got mine in the first place. The external connector can no longer be ordered though.
>>
>>> On Feb 6, 2017, at 5:26 AM, Sonny Hung <sonnyhung at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>
>>> Can I suggest someone check back into the archives.
>>> I know there was another user on the list who had a decent stash of the NIC
>>> connecters.
>>> They were selling them back awhile but I didn't need any myself and of
>>> course back then his price was a bit more than I wanted to pay per piece.
>>> Does anyone recall the individual? They were selling other Newton stuff
>>> back then. Hopefully this might help which ever direction this discussion
>>> is headed towards. Still lurking around. HTH
>>>
>>> God bless,
>>>
>>> Sonny Hung
>>> the Hung Family
>>>
>>> On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 10:24 PM, Jeff Sheldon <jeffsheldon at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Jake,
>>>>
>>>> Really cool about the wifi module. I'll look it over in more detail in the
>>>> morning.
>>>>
>>>> In this post-wired world, it seems like network is ideal for syncs and
>>>> package installs. Do we have a serial over TCP/IP solution yet? I think
>>>> of socat under Linux as an example of a similar beast.
>>>>
>>>> USB-C seems like a good solution for power and data, but I haven't looked
>>>> at the specs yet.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -Jeff
>>>>
>>>>> On Feb 5, 2017, at 15:30, Jake Bordens <jake at allaboutjake.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Jeff, the design is open for non-commercial use..
>>>> http://retronewton.blogspot.com or https://github.com/jake-b/
>>>> Newton-Internal-WiFi
>>>>>
>>>>> The board’s dimensions and fit are from trial and error, and probably
>>>> not perfect, but they work for a wifi card.. You don’t need the internal
>>>> screw because there aren’t any external mechanical stresses on the board.
>>>>>
>>>>> The module I chose because of its PPPD functionality, but an ESP8266 or
>>>> ESP32 would probably work with a SLIP or PPPD stack (I’m not sure if
>>>> something like that exists, or if it would need to be written).. An ESP
>>>> module would be better because the ConnectOne module is under encryption
>>>> export protection for some reason I don’t understand.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am not sure about USB-C either. You’d definitely need some
>>>> device-side circuitry to negotiate and request the 12v power supply. I’m
>>>> sure it’ll eventually be available in a commodity part.
>>>>>
>>>>> Given the two serial channels on the internal connector, would be
>>>> possible to do a dual WiFi/USB card, for sure. I also know Matthias was
>>>> working on something ESP8266 based too.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jake
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2/5/17, 4:21 PM, "newtontalk-bounces at newtontalk.net on behalf of
>>>> Jeff Sheldon" <newtontalk-bounces at newtontalk.net on behalf of
>>>> jeffsheldon at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Tony,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> It’s probably pretty likely that a USB to RS422 mini-din8 doesn’t
>>>> exist,
>>>>> but it’s likely that two compatible ends can be sourced based on a
>>>> quick
>>>>> Amazon search. I’ll go ahead and build one just a as a
>>>> proof-of-concept.
>>>>> I’m happy to see many solutions for USB-to-RS232 FTDI (cut wire)
>>>> cables out
>>>>> there presenting a variety of options.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> One issue I recall with the SER-001 was that people said it would
>>>> cause
>>>>> slight deformation to the case and even cracking because the PCB was
>>>> thick
>>>>> and pressed up against the case. I’m glad to see thinner PCBs readily
>>>>> available from DIY shops like OSH Park.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Jake,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I read about the WIFI board a while back, but memory escapes me—is
>>>> that
>>>>> your design? Very cool. the ESP chips are so amazingly dynamic and
>>>> cheap
>>>>> that I can easily see that being a good solution for a variety of
>>>> needs.
>>>>> USB-C is definitely forward-thinking…I don’t have anything that can
>>>> talk to
>>>>> it, but I think it’s worth pursuing for the long haul.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> There was some talk on here last spring about using cheap, highly
>>>> flexible,
>>>>> chips to expand Newton functionality in various ways (from the
>>>> internal
>>>>> port) other than for just network or sync. Do you recall the width
>>>> of the
>>>>> PCB on your design and do you have some photos of the product
>>>> online? Is
>>>>> this a closed design?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Dennis, thanks for that. Yes, “unscrupulous”. :-)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Does your SER-001 fit well or do you have that issue I was mentioning
>>>> with
>>>>> case fitment and pressure being applied by the thick PCB?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> David,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I’ve, too, have occasionally found the interconnect plug/sockets, but
>>>> yes,
>>>>> it’s amazingly difficult and they tend to no longer be available.
>>>> I’ll
>>>>> look into seeing if a new connector board can be made to sit on top
>>>> of the
>>>>> old pads and still use the existing case footprint. If I recall
>>>> correctly,
>>>>> I think even the original iPod/Pad/Phone connector had some
>>>> compatible pins
>>>>> for basic things which could be “corrected” as-needed with the minimal
>>>>> circuitry.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> All,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I haven’t checked on this in a while, but do we have a centralized
>>>> wiki or
>>>>> somesuch for active community projects and/or needs? It might be
>>>> nice to
>>>>> have a list of “must-haves” with people assigned to them (as
>>>> interested or
>>>>> testers if nothing more) and some documentation to go with those
>>>> ideas. My
>>>>> frustration since 1994 has been that many of the expansion solutions
>>>> that
>>>>> have turned up are closed and limited in availability. I’d love to
>>>> have
>>>>> some open projects which anyone can build and with a few alternatives
>>>> for
>>>>> parts should one supplier disappear. Might be nice to have a
>>>>> compatibility database for PCMCIA and CF cards, a list of expansion
>>>> units
>>>>> and software projects along with the developer(s) behind it, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Unrelated, I’m only now just finding this nice WIRED article
>>>> featuring some
>>>>> of our longstanding Newton heroes (and I tweeted a photo of that same
>>>> case
>>>>> a couple weeks ago):
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.wired.com/2013/08/the-newton-lives/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -Jeff
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Feb 5, 2017 at 2:17 PM, David Arnold <davida at pobox.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Jeff,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I’ve been trying (unsuccessfully, so far) to source the JAE interconnect
>>>>>> plugs and do a small run of adaptors. I’ve got a MiniDIN8 prototype
>>>> which
>>>>>> works with the Interconnect dongle, but I was hoping to eliminate the
>>>> need
>>>>>> for the dongle.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Given I’ve been unable to get the Interconnect plugs as surplus, I
>>>>>> considered getting a batch made. But given there seems to be perhaps a
>>>>>> market for about 50 such adaptors all up, the costs don’t work out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I’ve got 5 Interconnect plugs (plus an un-potted Interconnect adaptor)
>>>>>> that Newton Inc sent me while they existed, but otherwise I guess a
>>>>>> MiniDIN8 would be the next best thing?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> d
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 6 Feb 2017, at 05:14, Jeff Sheldon <jeffsheldon at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've had problems with the Prolific chipset in many applications. IMHO,
>>>>>> it's a cheap product cloned the world over and the drivers aren't well
>>>>>> maintained. FTDI is the way to go.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Adriano is scrupulous. 11 years ago, he privately pushed me to provide
>>>>>> details on adapters I was creating for the community to interface with
>>>> iPod
>>>>>> devices and a homebrew keyboard using the internal port. He even wanted
>>>> me
>>>>>> to store my progress on his personal storage space. When I resisted, he
>>>>>> backed down and suggested I contact Daniel Padilla to help with the
>>>>>> software side. After some back-and-forth, Daniel stopped responding. It
>>>>>> seemed strange. Unexpectedly, Adriano and Daniel released new products
>>>>>> based on the idea, though far less capable. It watered down the idea
>>>> and I
>>>>>> shelved my Newton, then dropped off the list for some time, also hiving
>>>> up
>>>>>> on my 2100 PCB mapping project (for the sake of creating minimized
>>>> designs).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If the community needs a USB solution, what would be the preference?
>>>>>> Internal card with port, Interconnect to USB end, or RS422 to USB? Seems
>>>>>> like the last--which people are talking about here--is the easiest and
>>>>>> cheapest solution. All three are doable, though those JAE ports are
>>>> hard to
>>>>>> find.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -Jeff
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Feb 5, 2017, at 06:47, Jake Bordens <jake at allaboutjake.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I recently purchased a FDTI serial cable for use in Mac OS Sierra and
>>>>>> it worked without drivers.. I had a prolific-chipset cable but the
>>>> driver
>>>>>> was causing my machine to crash, so I decided to get the FDTI since it
>>>> was
>>>>>> more compatible, and apparently did not need drivers (though I do a lot
>>>> of
>>>>>> tinkering so its possible I had a driver installed for another device.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I find it suspicious that it doesn’t show up as a USB device with a
>>>>>> PID/VID in the profiler… that would indicate that it isn’t even showing
>>>> up
>>>>>> on the USB bus. However silly, maybe try a different USB cable,
>>>> sometimes
>>>>>> cheap USB cables are charge-only. I’ve gotten bitten by that before.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Side note, I would like to acquire one of these “Adriano” dongles, if
>>>>>> anyone has a stash of them and is willing to part with one. Would make
>>>>>> development a little easier. My guess is that they are rare, and folks
>>>>>> don’t want to part with them, and for that I’d understand.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> ----------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>>>>>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>>>>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>>>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> -Jeff
>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> ----------
>>>>>
>>>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> http://newtontalk.net/
>>>>> http://twitter.com/newtontalk
>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
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>>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
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>>
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>
>
>
> --
> -Jeff
--
-Jeff
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