Re: [NTLK] Re[2]: Re[2]: Re[2]: Convincing argument against MS

From: Steven (
Date: Thu Jun 13 2002 - 12:02:28 EDT

I too think its about expectations...any maybe that's why I am more
disappointed with Apple than MS....Now don't go crazy before you read
the rest....

Apple markets itself as caring, unique, cool, fun, get a
real "feeling" about this when you get disappointed with
their actions you really "feel" it.
MS on the other hand is BIG, plowing, gobbling-up other companies, so
when they just continue to do what they have always done, you just say
to yourself, "that's what I expected." There is no disappointment.


-----Original Message-----
[] On Behalf Of Eric L. Strobel
Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2002 8:41 AM
Subject: Re: [NTLK] Re[2]: Re[2]: Re[2]: Convincing argument against MS

on 6/13/02 11:13 AM, Bradford Schmidt at wrote:

> Thursday, June 13, 2002, 9:55:05 AM, Eric wrote:
>> I guess one question is, if Apple had waited a year (which, BTW, has
>> provided them a year's worth of user feedback) and released 10.1 as
>> the initial release, would your beef about the older Rage hardware
>> seem as large? What would your response be, looking at the improved
>> support in 10.1.5? After all, they're *almost* there now.
> OK - Just to clarify my position: this thread was originally an
> anti-MS rant. I made a few points about the OS X releases and release
> dates, and drivers etc NOT to simply bash Apple, but to demonstrate
> that it's not black and white IN MY OPINION.

I hope that I've not misunderstood you (although I may have a bit). My
question above was an honest one because I'm curious about folks'
perceptions. Happiness is, after all, a matter of how one chooses to
manage their expectations. I may someday fall into the same motivations
and expectations and I (for one) would like to learn from others'
experiences in this.

> Both companies chase profits, both companies do things that they
> believe will best serve their bottom line. Just Because some people
> have a philosophical aversion to the way MS does business as opposed
> to Apple doesn't change that, nor does it change the fact that BOTH
> companies end up screwing some of the users some of the time
> (MS-haters may say all of the time :-)).

We're perhaps hung up on semantics. "Screwing" (to me, at least)
involves an active, deliberate intent to shortchange or take advantage
of someone -- to act against someone else's interest to further your
own. Apple's actions can be likened to triage -- they can't 'save'
everybody, so they have to put the resources where they do the most
good, rather than trying to 'save' everybody but ending up 'saving' no
one. Apple's actions, in both scale and in inimical nature, in no way
rise to the level of what MS has been convicted of (or for that matter,
other things they've done but not been prosecuted for). THAT, I think,
is the real source of misunderstanding in this thread (somehow equating
MS behavior with Apple behavior).

> By the way - I think I would have put OS X out there about the same
> time as well. Perhaps I would have suggested waiting to upgrade older
> machines though, before people (uh, like me) ponied up the 100 bux for

> an OS that at the time of its initial release was really pretty slow
> on my G4, and unusable on my G3's. I think the first usable version
> was like 10.0.4 (was that it? Anyone?)

I *think*, but I'm not 100% sure, that the various inadequacies WERE put
out there, but you are correct that they weren't made well enough known
quickly enough to prevent some folks from buying something they'd be
less than happy with. And of course, some folks gambled that the
support they wanted would be out shortly, and ended up losing that bet.


Eric Strobel (fyzycyst_at_NOSPAM^

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