Re: [NTLK] Convincing argument against MS

From: William B Davis Jr (
Date: Wed Jun 12 2002 - 01:52:43 EDT

On Monday, June 10, 2002, at 11:34 PM, Steven wrote:

> From: "Steven" <>
> Date: Mon Jun 10, 2002 11:34:19 PM US/Central
> To: <>
> Subject: Re: [NTLK] Convincing argument against MS
> Reply-To:

> What's it called when Apple charges TOP dollar for their products and
> then drops them like hot potatoes?
> (NEWTON, Clones, various chips and software)

What's it called? REALITY. Ever hear of it? You don't think EVERY
OTHER COMPANY does that too? Wake up and smell the coffee.

Re: TOP Dollar: Hello, Troll!

Anyone who's awake (or at least has bothered to Check The Facts knows that
this is a myth. $ for $, Apple products are usually cheaper in total cost
of ownership than competitors. You may pay more up front, but you pay
less in the long run. Don't believe it? Try the PC world for a while.
You'll be back. Grayer and poorer and with an ulcer.

Newton: Wasn't making money, had to go, I hate it too, but that's
business. I applaud Mr. Jobs for having the cojones to make the tough

Clones: Apple didn't make them, Mr. Troll. And they were stealing market
share FROM Apple instead of expanding the market into other areas as they'
d hoped. Had to go. Otherwise you wouldn't have an Apple to complain

Chips and software: Can you be more specific? Otherwise.....we'll just
assume you're moaning because you occasionally have to buy new stuff.
Don't like it? No one's forcing you to buy it, nor does it make your
existing computer less useful all of a sudden.

> Is that called $erving $atisfied citizen$ ???

If it's the difference between staying in business and not: YES.

> I've got 3 older mac$ and one mac clone...none can run O$X...they are in
> the clo$et...

First: Why do they have to run OS X? Does not being able to run OS X
suddenly make them useless? Macs have a far longer useful life than PCs,
  but even PCs can be useful a long time, for the right user. Give 'em to
friends, family, your grandma, etc, who don't have computers. (the Macs,
not the PC's. Friends don't let friends drive PCs). Donate 'em. Etc.

I was quite happy with OS9 on my PowerBook G3 from 1998, but upgraded
because I wanted to learn more about Unix, etc. Not because I needed to.
I didn't bother for over a year after it was released, but finally did
about a month ago. Most of my existing old non-firewire and non-usb
stuff works just fine, except for the floppy drive (for which there is a
3rd party driver) and the SCSI CD-R drive (which is SUPPOSED to work with
Toast, but doesn't for some reason; may not be Apple or Roxio's fault -
could be the drive, I had't used it in quite a while anyway....and I haven'
t tried it under OS 10.1.5 yet. Apple's been adding support for older
hardware consistently. My CF memory card in my PCMCIA adapter started
working again along about 10.1.3 or 10.1.4, for example. And my third
party USB and Firewire cards (not made by Apple) work dandy too.

Second: They must be pretty old Macs if the won't run OSX. Made in 1998
or earlier. You didn't mention that part, did you? I wonder why? My
FIVE YEAR OLD Apple Laptop runs OS X just fine. (How many PC users here
are using 5 year old machines as their primary machine? Or at all?)
One thing Apple may have done wrong over the years was support computers
from 10+ years before in their OSes. It didn't help them sales-wise. And
after all, Apple is in business to sell computers. Hell, I've got Macs
built 10 years ago that can run OS9. Got any PC's build FIVE years ago
that can run an equivalently current PC OS? Much less 10 years old? I
think Apple's finally borrowing from Microsoft's book for a change here.
Sure, we'd all like our Mac Pluses from 1984 to run OS X. Realistically.

Apple has finally wised up, and I'm happy to see it. I don't think buying
a new Mac every 5 years or so *IF* you want to keep up with the latest and
greatest is too much to ask. Many, many folks buy new CARS more often
than that. It's not like Apple's forcing you to do it, either.

I may buy a PowerBook G4, but frankly, I'm waiting to see what 10.2
(Jaguar) will provide me before I spend the bucks. It may not be

> gue$$ it$ time to $pend more money on a new Apple and hope
> that $teven Job$ doe$n't di$continue it for another few month$
> I'm $o happy that Apple is really about $erving the Cu$tomer

Oh please. If more self-proclaimed "loyal Mac owners" DID spend more
money on Apple products more often, perhaps they WOULDN'T have to cut the
fat occasionally. Instead, you want to have your cake and eat it too.
"Please, Mr jobs, make my 5+ year old computer run the latest OS without
me having to spend any more $$$". Well, we've what ACTUALLY DOING THAT
has gotten Apple's market share. They've finally woken up to realize that
they have to SELL PRODUCT in order to stay around and provide us with good
product. (Wherease Micro$haft only stays around to sell us product, and
don't care about the quality of it.)

Don't like it? Don't let the door (or Window) hit you in the ass on your
way out. And have fun crashing under Windows or figuring out how to get
your latest Linux kernel to compile.

It's been my experience that Apple has been among the best companies at
return on investment, product lifetime, and total cost of ownership. Your
complaintes are bogus and deserve being slapped down.

  - Bill

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